Holy Mother of God !

[Very Rev.Dr Andrew M. B. Patrick]

The topic in this statement is the Virgin Mother. Although I was raised Catholic, I am first and foremost a born-again Christian, it is that " I understand and except many different faiths and their beliefs, we can draw from anyone of them at anytime".

It is biblical and it doesn't have to be just a Catholic thing or any other denominational thing. If it shows the love and respect that Christ tried to show us and if the angels and the saints were good enough for Christ to call on or God sending them to him, then why does it have to be any other way. It doesn't.

We all are God fearing and Jesus loving and Holy Spirit blessed Christians, it doesn't matter to me what church you belong to or belonged to, as long as you except Jesus Christ as your savior and that you believe that he is the son of God and that all things are possible for him. Not impossible.

So I am saying here and now that the blessed mother should be called upon in our hour and time of need and suffering. If God can call upon her for service then so should we.

When we hurt our selves, even when we are older, do we not many times cry out for our mortal mothers? So now that we are Born-Again Christians, that means to me that the Blessed Mother is also our mother, she is our spiritual mother and she is with the Father and the Son and all the saints, RIGHT?

To me some, not all but some traditions, are good and should not be forgotten, the premise with this ministry is the motto of the Universal Life Church which is a non-denominational church and body of clergy from all kinds of backgrounds and beliefs but that doesn't matter as long as you "do what you know is right", and I feel it is right and just to give respect to the Virgin Mother, Mary. AMEN !

I'm not chastising anyone here, I'm merely making a point that it is fitting and proper to call on the Holy Mother of Christ in our time of need as well as to Christ himself.

Rev.Fr.A.R.M.Manley D.D. Chaplain...

[Very Rev.Dr Andrew M. B. Patrick]

Thank you Sister Hanna, sorry for taking such a long time to getback online here with the A.O.C.I.

I have missed you all so very much, though you all have been in mydevotions all this time.

I can appreciate your statement and I see your point as well. Yes,I am also sure that for every context I make in proving my pointhere, you shall be able to do the same. That just goes to show thatthe scriptures mean different things to different folks. It is amatter of the Christian faith and the faithful going down"denominational" or even "traditional", paths ofdoctrine.

If this were not so, than justify to mewhy Christianity being "the largest religious belief system inthe world with more than 2.2 billion people world wide and, that ofChristianity it's self with more than 33,820 differentdenominations”. So which of the is right and which is wrong? Thatis to say they all read and preach from the same book don't they? Howthen can we as "Christians", judge one another for adoctrine or belief or even, lack of doctrine that excepts andprofesses the same writings of the inspired word of God?

Don't worry, I'm not setting anyone up to argue one point oranother. What I will say is that I believe in the same scriptures asthe next person, it is neither ludicrous nor any more dangerous thanthe other beliefs. Meaning again, that it is left to"interpretation". As an example of which I am sure, I'mgoing to press more than a few buttons when I state this but, I hopeit will open the heart and minds of clergy that have taken the "hardline of indoctrination to an extreme to their congregations. Myexample is this and I'll try to be fair and open minded when I saythis because it is a stretch to even put them into the same categoryof "Christian Faith".

OK, take a deep breath now, let it out slowly, and here goes. Inthe deep south here in the USA over our history as a nation, or eventhroughout the worlds history there have been 10's of thousands ofincidents documented throughout, but I will refrain and restrainmyself to American history and that being an example of the blackchurch congregations preaching from the KJV of the Holy Bible as wellas say, members of the "KKK', which drew their rhetoric fromthe same book. Yet lets bring the time line up a bit and, remindfolks that racial tensions were still prevalent almost 100 yearslater, in the 1950's and 60's, when segregation was at an all timehigh in this country. We believed in the promises of the samescripture then, didn't we? Though if you want to say that, then thatwas the dark days of our history. I might give you that, but I wouldagain remind you that of even more recent history being that we havehad church burnings, people beaten, communities in an upheaval, andyet we still all read from the same scripture.

I guess you could say it's not the same thing, that some groups of"Christians are more radical than others and yet some are morepassive than others”. Then in that case, I would have to say youare correct again. BUT, (I just love that word, that and the one callif), they both are the two most misused words in the Englishlanguage. Well, I've said it once I've said it a thousand times andthat is that it is the clergies fault. And yes I resemble the remarkand NO, I'm not point the proverbial finger at any one denominationbut I am pointing three of them back at myself. That is to say forsitting in a building week after week, month after month and yearafter year in a pew called a church and then having someone I wasalways taught that they were an expert on the subject of Christianvalues, preaching doctrine to me until I was old enough to understandfor myself the error of most every denomination of Christianity inthe world.

That is all 33 plus thousand of them and some 14 thousand here inthe good old U. S. of A. Please, I don't sit back and just think upthis stuff up, I do however, sit back and try to make since of theworld religions and why one thinks they have all the right answerswhile all others, are doomed to spend an eternity in the fiery pit ofhell for not believing the same things that another does.

Isn't this very thing still happening today? One might say yes,while another, will say no. But (there’s that little word again),but, I say we need more diversity in our congregations, we need to beteaching the scriptures that relate to tolerance and the "lovethy neighbor as they self teachings. Granted, there is a "war"going on with the sides being "us against them", you knowwhat I'm referring to and you can take that anyway you'd like to,(but),...lol...if it looks like a skunk and it smells like a skunkthan don't sit or stand there and tell me that it's a kitty cat.Because I just might believe you or maybe not. That doesn't mean thatI want to harm you or your family or even your country. Just becauseI don't agree with you. It does however mean, that I have a right to"interpret what is said and that I have a right in my own selfto make up my own mind as to what is truth and what is fiction orrather a lie. Shucks, we can't even keep our own children from goingdown a path that we know we would not. But to each his own.Diversity, it is a wonderful thing.

When I was just a young lad in my freshman year of high school, Ihad taken an elective course in this very subject. Not becausesomeone told me I had to, nor because I thought it would be good forme to experience. See as I've said before I was raised Roman Catholicand in the community I grew up in, there were tensions between theCatholic's and the Baptists and they were always at odds with eachother, things like spare the rod not the child while the other wouldsay spare the child and not the rod, and it effected the community asa whole. As an example I offer you this analogy, Catholic childrendid not associate with Baptist children outside of the class roomunless it was behind our parents backs, or unless you grew up in ahouse hold that was taught tolerance. As for the other faiths withinthe community, they just kinda sat back and let the two largestgroups of "faith" go at each other. Then from the pulpitthey would make their case for their belief. Then there were thecommunity functions that were supposed to be community oriented. Itseemed that the only time things would settle down was during themajor school sporting event when we would come together to route forour home team, that is unless we where playing against each other.

I know, I've gone off Que a bit, then again have I? When I said itwas biblical I meant what I said, part of the universal or anotherword for universal is Catholic, praying of the "hail Mary"comes from the book of Luke chapter 1, verse 28 through 48 and it isin this part of scripture that the "universal / Catholic, prayerknown as the "Hail Mary" is thought to have come from andit has been around since the year 1263, maybe even further back, noone is for sure. What is fact is that it was being said several timesa day in and around the third century by the Franciscan monks of thetime.

So again my question is, that if the Catholic Church being themost powerful and domineering religion in the world at that point inworld history gives us some indication as to how long and how manypeople through the years have been reciting this little known prayer.Than how can you say it should not be recited or said. I know, Jesustaught us how to pray and with what words to say, that doesn't meanhowever that all prayer is wrong and should not be said. For if whatyou say should be the way and I would say that most of the other 33plus thousand denominations would concur, than that would make ourancestors Hippocrates. For that would be out right un-ttolerable withthe church law of the day. Just like Jesus' teachings were in directconflict with Jewish law.

What folks seem to misunderstand the mostabout this prayer is that we who recite it are not praying to Marybut asking her to pray for us. Here are a few facts, not that many ofyou who may read this will agree with it is however no never mind tome. For we are all subject to our own judgment before the the Fatherand Christ defending us through intersession on our behalf. It isstill after all, "FACT”.

The meaning of the Hail Mary prayer as I have already eluded to,is to ask Mary to pray for us. She is immaculate. She also has neverdispleased God, and she gave birth to God the Son who had becomeflesh by the power of the Holy Ghost. This as you pointed out wasdone by the will of God and that He used Mary for His purpose as Heeven still today uses us to do His work in this world.

Don't take my comments the wrong way, it is not my intent to picka fight or start my own personal Holy War...(Funny thing about thoselast two words in this statement, I don't ever recall the two wordsever being used by Christ in His teachings and nor in my studies ofthe Kuran do the words appear together in the same sentience). Butwhat is another fact is that what may be the "hope of the worldfrom killing each other off, is the blessed mother of Christ, who isthe Holy Mother of God. How can I say such a thing you maybe asking,it is almost sacrilegious that I would even imply such a statement.Well folks It's the Gods truth and I shall not apologize for iteither.

If I'm not mistaken the blessed mother in reference to the birthof Jesus who also being recognized as the King of the Jews and Himruling over the house of David forever is mentioned several times. Ithink I read or heard somewhere, that she may be the saving grace ofhumanity yet once again, for she is mentioned more than 30 times inthe book of Islam. Although as with several Christian faiths, I'msure there are those in the Islamic faith that would disagree withthese facts as well...Ohhhhya, that’s whats going on right thisvery minute isn't it? Disagreement on the spiritual plain.

Folks from all faiths, beliefs and or religion need to learn toaccept change and tolerance and quite listening to doctrine, butinstead, learn theology, for it is diversification that will aid usin our tomorrows.

Well folks thanks and may God bless you and again thank you foryour comments, I appreciate you as well. As for other folks that willdiffer just to differ, then I just hope you are not right, for if youare, than there is little hope for mankind, ever! But...:)...Ibelieve in two very important sayings and I have taken some libertyhere because it is instilled into my heart and sole and that being,as for me and my house we shall serve the Lord for he is the truththe light and the way, for a house divided cannot stand...the latterpart being from the books of Matthew, 12:25, Mark, 3:25 and Luke,11:17...for are we to believe these three men of God are wrong, Nay,I say for they are only quoting God, aren't they...?

Sincerely, the Lord Jesus' humble servent to humanity,

Msgr. Andrew R. M. Manley DD. O.S.M. Chaplain

[Dr. Henry, President of the AOCI]

Interesting Article Dr. Manley. I think I understand your article and to be honest, I don't think anyone has ever put it this way. Mary was and is the mother of God (Jesus).....hum....when you stop to think about this, some of the points you make start to make sense. In addition, I also know that YOU DO NOT BELIEVE OR HAVE YOUR ASSURANCE OF SALVATION IN MARY, so that is refreshing.

Thanks for challenging our minds here.

God bless.

[Very Rev.Dr Andrew M. B. Patrick]

Dr. Hunt,

I am not arguing anything that you have said, for I know this already. I am not talking about salvation, or healing, or anything like that. Yes I know that Christ is the comforter but, the way this statement was made was in my answer to someones question dealing with a family being torn apart, by actions of other members of this family. The person was stating a fact that was happing in regards to the emotional stress that her mother was going through. In the way that the situation was tearing her heart apart from the hurtful things being said about their family. This response was meant as a way to help the mother and others deal with the stress of the accusations.

The blessed mother suffered immensely, because of the accusations of those that lied and manipulated facts to justify the end means for the crucifixion of her son our savior Jesus Christ. I do believe that by calling on the saints from time to time, we can draw into a deeper relationship with our own spirituality, which when you think about it, is a major problem with society today that is that we are not deeply faithful in our beliefs. There are many other faiths in our world that are more devoted to their beliefs than we so called Christians are about the our relationship with the Holy Trinity.

We all have a purpose on this planet we call home. That also went for those that came before us, and it will go for those that come after us as well. As an example to this statement I will refer to the Bible itself, words written by others on events of their day, which we today still hold true and dear to our hearts and directly responsible for our salvation and guidance on how we should live and treat others. This is a fact throughout history of the world, even today when a commentary is made or an editorial is published in regards to religious beliefs it can move the masses into action.

There is no difference today nor yesterday nor tomorrow as for what people will have to go through in order to get through a tough situation, but yet never forgetting that love and wisdom, compassion and sympathy are gifts that Father has give to each and everyone in the world, but that there are those that do not use these gifts.

If knowledge is power and there is power in the word of God through the writings of the Holy Bible, than how can my statement be untrue. Do ministers not manipulate the words of the bible to fit their sermons or express their point by quoting bits and pieces to fit the need of a situation, and yet taking the true intent of those scriptures to the extreme of their meaning? I know that when I lose something, I say a small prayer to St. Anthony to help guide me to finding that lost item and there it is, and when I was a fireman, I prayed not only to God but also to Saint Florian and to St. Michael for protection when I was in security and bodyguard work.

How is this a wrong thing, when we as a culture of Christians and non Christians celebrate holidays like, Valentines day, Halloween and All saints day or even our national day of prayer. The fact remains that people will cry out for help when the need arises and mostly they cry out to God, when they should be crying out to Jesus, yet Jesus doesn't get offended.

For is it not true that the only unforgivable sin is blaspheme against the Holy Spirit? Then for sure the Holy Trinity will not mind us to seek the comfort of the blessed mother if it helps us to remember who she was, or is, that is to say the mother of God, bringing us back full circle to where God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit want us in the first place and that is to have them first in our lives, first in our thoughts, and first in the words off the tip of our tongues?

So no brother I am not arguing with you nor am I going to debate the issue, I am a non-denominational chaplain, and I do as the spirit of God commands me, just as he has done with me in writing the response to you with this message.

God bless you and your ministry, and may you bring 100,000 souls to the alter for the Holy Trinity to be glorified and praised from now through eternity. Amen

Rev.Fr. Andrew R. M. Manley D.D. Chaplain